Undecided between two specs

[lewsTherin79]

Hello !
I'm planning to buy a new notebook in the next couple months, so I configured a couple solutions. I don't know which one is more worth, performance-side. The difference in price is not a problem.

This is the first one

Telaio e display
Defiance Series: widescreen LED 72% NTSC opaco, full HD 17,3" e 144 Hz (1920 x 1080)
Processore (CPU)
Processore Intel® Core™ i7 8750H 6 core (2,2 GHz, 4,1 GHz Turbo)
Memoria (RAM)
DDR4 SODIMM Corsair 2400 MHz 16 GB (2 da 8 GB)
Scheda grafica
NVIDIA® GeForce® RTX 2070 Max-Q – RAM video 8,0 GB GDDR6 – DirectX® 12.1
1o Unità di archiviazione
DISCO RIGIDO SEAGATE 1 TB 7 mm SERIAL ATA III 2,5" CON CACHE 128 MB (7.200 giri/minuto)
1o drive SSD M.2
SSD PCIe INTEL® 760p M.2 NVMe 256 GB (fino a 3210 MB/sR | 1315 MB/sW)
Lettore di schede di memoria
Lettore schede 6 in 1 integrato (SD/Mini SD/SDHC/SDXC/MMC/RSMMC)
Adattatore CA
1 adattatore CA 180 W
Batteria
Batteria Li-Ion 4 celle Defiance Series (62 WH)
Cavo di alimentazione
1 cavo di alimentazione europeo a trifoglio 1 metro
Pasta termica
PARTE TERMICA COOLER MASTER MASTERGEL MAKER
Scheda audio
Audio alta definizione 2 canali + Jack microfono/cuffie
Bluetooth e wireless
LAN GIGABIT e KILLER™ WIRELESS-AC 1550 M.2 GAMING 802.11AC + BLUETOOTH 5.0
Opzioni USB/Thunderbolt
2 PORTE USB 3.1 (tipo C) + 2 PORTE USB 3.1
Lingua tastiera
TASTIERA RETROILLUMINATA RGB ITALIANA
Sistema operativo
NESSUN SISTEMA OPERATIVO RICHIESTO
Lingua del sistema operativo
Italia/Italia – Lingua italiana
Supporto di ripristino Windows
NESSUN RIPRISTINO RICHIESTO
Software Office
Prova GRATUITA 30 giorni di Microsoft® Office® 365 (richiesto sistema operativo)
Antivirus
NESSUN SOFTWARE ANTIVIRUS
Browser
Google Chrome™
Supporti di raffreddamento per portatile
Dissipatore laptop NotePal L2, fino a 17,3"
Mouse per Notebook
MOUSE TOUCHPAD 2 PULSANTI INTEGRATO
Webcam
WEBCAM HD 1 MP INTEGRATA
Garanzia
Garanzia Silver di 3 anni (1 anno Ritiro e reso, 2 anni Ricambi, 3 anni Manodopera)
Garanzia dead pixel
Garanzia dead pixel 1 anno inclusi costi di manodopera e trasporto
Consegna
3 - 4 GIORNI PER LA SPEDIZIONE IN ITALIA
Tempo di costruzione
Costruzione standard – da 5 a 7 giorni lavorativi
Quantity
1

Prezzo €1.748,00 compreso IVA e consegna

This is the second one:

Telaio e display
Recoil Series: widescreen LED 72% NTSC opaco, full HD 17,3" e 144 Hz (1920 x 1080)
Processore (CPU)
Processore Intel® Core™ i7 8750H 6 core (2,2 GHz, 4,1 GHz Turbo)
Memoria (RAM)
DDR4 SODIMM Corsair 2400 MHz 16 GB (2 da 8 GB)
Scheda grafica
NVIDIA® GeForce® RTX 2060 – RAM video 6,0 GB GDDR6 – DirectX® 12.1
1o Unità di archiviazione
DISCO RIGIDO SEAGATE 1 TB 7 mm SERIAL ATA III 2,5" CON CACHE 128 MB (7.200 giri/minuto)
1o drive SSD M.2
SSD PCIe INTEL® 760p M.2 NVMe 256 GB (fino a 3210 MB/sR | 1315 MB/sW)
Lettore di schede di memoria
Lettore schede 3 in 1 integrato (SD/SDHC/SDXC)
Adattatore CA
1 x Adattatore 180W AC
Batteria
Batteria Li-Ion Recoil II Series 46 WH
Cavo di alimentazione
1 cavo di alimentazione europeo a trifoglio 1 metro
Pasta termica
PARTE TERMICA COOLER MASTER MASTERGEL MAKER
Scheda audio
2 canali alta def. Audio + SoundBlaster™ Cinema
Bluetooth e wireless
LAN GIGABIT e KILLER™ WIRELESS-AC 1550 M.2 GAMING 802.11AC + BLUETOOTH 5.0
Opzioni USB/Thunderbolt
1 PORTA USB 3.1 (tipo C) + 2 PORTE USB 3.0 + 1 PORTA USB 2.0
Lingua tastiera
TASTIERA MECCANICA ITALIANA SILENZIOSA CON ILLUMINAZIONE RGB INDIVIDUALE DEI TASTI
Sistema operativo
NESSUN SISTEMA OPERATIVO RICHIESTO
Lingua del sistema operativo
Italia/Italia – Lingua italiana
Supporto di ripristino Windows
NESSUN RIPRISTINO RICHIESTO
Software Office
Prova GRATUITA 30 giorni di Microsoft® Office® 365 (richiesto sistema operativo)
Antivirus
NESSUN SOFTWARE ANTIVIRUS
Browser
Microsoft® Edge (solo con Windows 10)
Supporti di raffreddamento per portatile
Dissipatore laptop NotePal L2, fino a 17,3"
Mouse per Notebook
MOUSE TOUCHPAD 2 PULSANTI INTEGRATO
Webcam
WEBCAM HD 1 MP INTEGRATA
Garanzia
Garanzia Silver di 3 anni (1 anno Ritiro e reso, 2 anni Ricambi, 3 anni Manodopera)
Garanzia dead pixel
Garanzia dead pixel 1 anno inclusi costi di manodopera e trasporto
Consegna
3 - 4 GIORNI PER LA SPEDIZIONE IN ITALIA
Tempo di costruzione
Costruzione standard – da 5 a 7 giorni lavorativi
Quantity
1

Prezzo €1.647,00 compreso IVA e consegna

Few days ago there was also the possibility to put 2070 non max Q in the Defiance model (which I would prefer because of the four USB3.1 ports and better battery than recoil), but it's not available anymore. Is it temporary or 2070 has been moved only to octane model (that costs too much money unfortunately) ?
Also, not sure which GPU between 2060 and 2070 max Q runs better in mid-long term, because looking at notebook check benchmarks, today 2060 seems running better on average. Can I consider those two gpus similar in terms of power?
Thanks to anybody who'll throw his/her 2 cents

 

[Oussebon]

The RTX 2070 Max-Q is usually better than the 2060, but not by much, and it varies from chassis to chassis.

Personally I would probably go with the Recoil as it is less expsnive, gives similar performance, and is supposed to have decent cooling.

 

[Mustafo95]

The price already seems to be signalling the right decision for you. Get the one with RTX 2070, whichever version you get, at least it'll be 8GB VRAM. I'm not a hardware specialist or anything but with RTX 2070 and 2080 you're getting the complete chip, full memory bandwith and all that jazz. With RTX 2060, you're getting cut down version of those 2 better cards, also only 6GB of VRAM.
If you look up the reviews on youtube, many games at ultra quality details need somewhere between 5-9 GB of VRAM. With 8GB VRAM, you'll have a peace of mind that you didn't compromise.
Also RTX 2060 barely has any RT cores, it's not enough even if you wanted to turn it on. It's probably good enough for demos and special effects in certain scenes, but not for continuous use.
I was in the same place as you few weeks ago, and researched the hell out of this topic. You're already at a point where the decision is between RTX 2060 and RTX 2070, so you should get RTX 2070. Now if it was between GTX 1660 TI and maybe some other Vega 56, AMD cards, then it'd be a real challenge. Not in your case, not this time.

 

[Oussebon]

The price already seems to be signalling the right decision for you. Get the one with RTX 2070, whichever version you get, at least it'll be 8GB VRAM. I'm not a hardware specialist or anything but with RTX 2070 and 2080 you're getting the complete chip, full memory bandwith and all that jazz. With RTX 2060, you're getting cut down version of those 2 better cards, also only 6GB of VRAM.

The VRAM is irrelevant, 6gb is more than fine, even for 1440p, let alone 1080p.
https://www.techspot.com/article/1785-nvidia-geforce-rtx-2060-vram-enough/

If you look up the reviews on youtube, many games at ultra quality details need somewhere between 5-9 GB of VRAM. With 8GB VRAM, you'll have a peace of mind that you didn't compromise.

And that's why we don't rely on garbage on youtube.

RT is something of a writeoff at the moment anyway, and by the time it's mainstream it will probably only make sense on later gens of cards with more mature hardware.

Also, Nvidia's current approach is to mitigate the impact of raytracing through DLSS - which is nuts for 1080p as it means you're playing a superscaled 720p game...

Regardless of the Max-Q's extra cores, the fact is it doesn't perform very much better than a 2060.

Honestly, this is terrible advice with no basis.

 

[lewsTherin79]

The price already seems to be signalling the right decision for you. Get the one with RTX 2070, whichever version you get, at least it'll be 8GB VRAM. I'm not a hardware specialist or anything but with RTX 2070 and 2080 you're getting the complete chip, full memory bandwith and all that jazz. With RTX 2060, you're getting cut down version of those 2 better cards, also only 6GB of VRAM.
If you look up the reviews on youtube, many games at ultra quality details need somewhere between 5-9 GB of VRAM. With 8GB VRAM, you'll have a peace of mind that you didn't compromise.
Also RTX 2060 barely has any RT cores, it's not enough even if you wanted to turn it on. It's probably good enough for demos and special effects in certain scenes, but not for continuous use.
I was in the same place as you few weeks ago, and researched the hell out of this topic. You're already at a point where the decision is between RTX 2060 and RTX 2070, so you should get RTX 2070. Now if it was between GTX 1660 TI and maybe some other Vega 56, AMD cards, then it'd be a real challenge. Not in your case, not this time.

Problem is, the one I posted with 2070 has max Q version, which seems on par with 2060 in terms of benchmarks (not so few recent games runs even slower on 2070 max Q than 2060, according to notebookcheck, which is not the bible but is a reliable source). Only difference right now is VRAM basically.
Actually RTX 2070 non max Q is only on the most expensive laptop model and I can't spend more than 2.3k€ just to have 2070. A few days ago (last week) I made spec with Defiance model and 2070 "regular" (non max Q), but it's not an option for the model anymore lately . If I had the money at the time I would've bought that immediately!
The same spec I posted in OP but with 2070 non maxQ costed about ~1850/1900 €, which was perfect for what I could get. Let's hope that price comes back in the near future

 

[Oussebon]

Have you phoned PC Specialist? Maybe ask if they have 2070s coming back into stock? They might confirm what's going on.

 

[lewsTherin79]

Yeah I'll probably do that in the near future.

 

[Mustafo95]

The VRAM is irrelevant, 6gb is more than fine, even for 1440p, let alone 1080p.
https://www.techspot.com/article/1785-nvidia-geforce-rtx-2060-vram-enough/

"And that's why we don't rely on garbage on youtube"

"Honestly, this is terrible advice with no basis"

EXPERt deStroYS NOob enthuSiasT wIth FaCtS aND LoGIC
No but really, I guess I must have picked the wrong sources to check. But most of the time RTX 2070 should be better than RTX 2060, not sure how that's affected by max-q tradeoffs. RTX 2070 laptop version is already slightly inferior to the desktop RTX 2070, maq-q probably strips away that last piece of supremacy that RTX 2070 has over RTX 2060 normally.

 

[Oussebon]

https://www.techspot.com/review/1812-geforce-rtx-2080-max-q-laptop/
Obviously it varies a bit from game to game, but that's not an unfair representation.

To our surprise, the RTX 2060 isn’t much slower than the RTX 2070 Max-Q on average. We’re talking 4% slower on average, with some games clocking in faster than what is supposed to be a higher tier GPU. This could place prospective RTX 2070 Max-Q buyers in an awkward position.
https://www.techspot.com/review/1812-geforce-rtx-2080-max-q-laptop/

The Tongfang Recoil chassis have generally seemed to cause less concern to owners on these forums than the Clevo Defiances with regards to CPU temps as well.

The Defiance doesn't really sell itself tbh.

Hopefully choices will be a bit easier once PCS clarify what's going on with their lineup, as a Recoil with a 2070 (non-max-Q) would in any event seem to be the ideal

 

[Oussebon]

Edit: Notebookcheck has a 2070 Max-Q lower than a 2060 (laptop) https://tinyurl.com/y24p7afz so I guess there's some variation between chassis as one would expect to factor in as well.

I say edit, except the forum's not letting me do the edit, so separate post >.<

 

[lewsTherin79]

Interesting read here, thanks all. So, since I'm getting a laptop with a 1080 screen (and i'm not going to get a secondary monitor for 1440p), 2060 seems the right choice, because it should run at max settings in 1080p all 2019, 2020 games and it could start to need lower settings in 3 years and maybe struggle with VRAM in 4 years. Though it's very hard to foresee what will happen in 3 years or more, to me it seems a reasonable duration for a laptop GPU. Actually, the only future games I'm most interested to get are cyberpunk 2077 and The Outer Worlds. Hopefully 2060 will be able to run them with ultra settings at reasonable speed...

 

[Oussebon]

cyberpunk 2077 and The Outer Worlds

werd