Quiet spec PC arrived and it's not quiet at all

[jergil]

PC arrived today and a big requirement for me was that the PC be quiet but it's not. Seems to be the top mounted fans that are the culprits. After speaking with @SpyderTracks who has been very helpful, he recommended I open a tech support thread.

Previous thread:

Spec check for 1440p @144Hz gaming + music production

For quiet high-ish spec gaming + hobbyist music production Already have the GPU: ASUS - GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER OC Edition 12 GB TUF GAMING Graphics Card And monitor: LG UltraGear 27GN88A I'm mostly wondering about upgrading to the Strix for audio quality and what air cooler to go for. Is it...

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Specs:

PCSPECIALIST - Configure the AMD Am5 PC to your ideal requirements.

PCSpecialist is an award-winning manufacturer of high quality custom PCs & Laptops. Configure the AMD Am5 PC to your ideal requirements.

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+ ASUS - GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER OC Edition 12 GB TUF GAMING Graphics Card

In terms of noise levels, I can easily hear the fans through my open cup headphones and over the moderate rain outside. It's about the same perceived volume as your own mouth breathing.

I'm assuming I should install some fan curve software or something?

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[SpyderTracks]

PC arrived today and a big requirement for me was that the PC be quiet but it's not. Seems to be the top mounted fans that are the culprits. After speaking with @SpyderTracks who has been very helpful, he recommended I open a tech support thread.

Previous thread:

Spec check for 1440p @144Hz gaming + music production

For quiet high-ish spec gaming + hobbyist music production Already have the GPU: ASUS - GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER OC Edition 12 GB TUF GAMING Graphics Card And monitor: LG UltraGear 27GN88A I'm mostly wondering about upgrading to the Strix for audio quality and what air cooler to go for. Is it...

www.pcspecialist.co.uk

Specs:

PCSPECIALIST - Configure the AMD Am5 PC to your ideal requirements.

PCSpecialist is an award-winning manufacturer of high quality custom PCs & Laptops. Configure the AMD Am5 PC to your ideal requirements.

www.pcspecialist.co.uk

+ ASUS - GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER OC Edition 12 GB TUF GAMING Graphics Card

In terms of noise levels, I can easily hear the fans through my open cup headphones and over the moderate rain outside. It's about the same perceived volume as your own mouth breathing.

I'm assuming I should install some fan curve software or something?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Could you copy and paste the full specs from the order page here please? Leave out your windows key and any promo keys.

And which fans are loud? You'll need to isolate the ones causing the noise.

 

[jergil]

On closer inspection the rear fan is definitely the loudest, then the front fan and then the top fans (which are actually fine). The mesh top made me think initially that most of the noise was coming from the top fans but that actually isn't the case.

Case
FRACTAL DEFINE 7 BLACK QUIET MID-TOWER CASE
Processor (CPU)
AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D Eight Core CPU (4.2GHz-5.0GHz/104MB w/3D V-CACHE/AM5)
Motherboard
ASUS® ROG STRIX X670E-A GAMING WIFI (AM5, DDR5, PCIe 5.0, Wi-Fi 6E)
Memory (RAM)
32GB Corsair VENGEANCE RGB DDR5 6000MHz (2 x 16GB)
Graphics Card
NONE, I ALREADY HAVE A GRAPHICS CARD(Model: ASUS - GeForce RTX 4070 SUPER OC Edition 12 GB TUF GAMING Graphics Card, Ports: Not known)
Graphics Card Support Bracket
NONE (BRACKET INCLUDED AS STANDARD ON 4070 Ti / RX 7700 XT AND ABOVE)
1st M.2 SSD Drive
512GB SOLIDIGM P44 PRO GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7000MB/sR, 4700MB/sW)
2nd M.2 SSD Drive
2TB SOLIDIGM P41+ GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 4125MB/sR, 3325MB/sW)
1st Storage Drive
4TB SEAGATE BARRACUDA SATA-III 3.5" HDD, 6GB/s, 5400RPM, 256MB CACHE
DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
NOT REQUIRED
Power Supply
CORSAIR 1000W RMx SERIES™ - MODULAR 80 PLUS GOLD, ULTRA QUIET
Power Cable
1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead, 1.0mm Core)
Processor Cooling
CORSAIR iCUE H115i ELITE CAPELLIX XT RGB High Performance CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste
STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING
Sound Card
ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)
Network Card
ONBOARD 2.5Gbe LAN PORT
Wireless Network Card
NOT REQUIRED
USB/Thunderbolt Options
MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS
Operating System
Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence
Operating System Language
United Kingdom - English Language
Windows Recovery Media
Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account
Office Software
FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)
Anti-Virus
NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE
Browser
Firefox™
Surge Protection
6 Socket 2m Surge Protector
Cable Management
PCS 1.5M Zip Cable Tidy - Professional Cable Management
Warranty
3 Year Silver Warranty (1 Year Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)
Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)
Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 4 to 6 working days
Miscellaneous
PCSpecialist 2023 Holo Sticker Sheet
Welcome Book
PCSpecialist Welcome Book

 

[SpyderTracks]

So this happens sometimes with this case, IIRC it has a fan hub as part of the case which then traces back to a fan header on the board.

My guess is it’s been put in the incorrect port on the motherboard. If you trace it back to the board and let us know which header it’s on?

Also track the rear fan, is that going directly onto the board and if so which header or is it going via the controller?

 

[Scott]

Just spotted this thread. This is good news. It definitely sounds like a config issue with the case fans. They stock fans from Fractal are actually really good for acoustics, I was quite impressed with them. There shouldn't be a lot of noise from them at all once configured properly. Good to know the AIO itself seems fine, you can tweak it further if you need to as well though.

 

[jergil]

@SpyderTracks

Righto so after some judicious cable tie snipping I have discovered some things:

The 2 top fans are connected to the fan/rgb hub which is no. 2 in yellow.

The rear fan is connected to the no.3 in green which turns out is CHA_FAN1.

Front fan I couldn't trace easily but I suspect it is connected somehow to blue 1 on the left, labelled RP PWM, which eventually leads to CHA_FAN5, AKA blue 1 on the right

Then, tracing the relevant cable from the fan/rgb hub leads me to one of these 3 locations in red; A (AAFP), B (USB_P14 15) and C (USB16_17) not sure which, but I'm hoping that is enough for someone to diagnose.

CHA_FAN 2, 3, 4 are unoccupied.

That was interesting! What next, captain?

 

[SpyderTracks]

@SpyderTracks


View attachment 42330


Righto so after some judicious cable tie snipping I have discovered some things:

The 2 top fans are connected to the fan/rgb hub which is no. 2 in yellow.

The rear fan is connected to the no.3 in green which turns out is CHA_FAN1.

Front fan I couldn't trace easily but I suspect it is connected somehow to blue 1 on the left, labelled RP PWM, which eventually leads to CHA_FAN5, AKA blue 1 on the right

Then, tracing the relevant cable from the fan/rgb hub leads me to one of these 3 locations in red; A (AAFP), B (USB_P14 15) and C (USB16_17) not sure which, but I'm hoping that is enough for someone to diagnose.

View attachment 42329

CHA_FAN 2, 3, 4 are unoccupied.

That was interesting! What next, captain?

Hiya

Apologies, had to crash out.

For now we're only concerned about the case fans.

The PWM controller for the case is what's pictured in the top left picture with the green 3 being a case fan header, and the blue 1 being the controller main connector that plugs into the motherboard. Really all the case fan headers should be plugged into that, so we should see the 4pin on the rights to the motherboard, and then all three 3 pin case fan headers connected on the board to the left of that

With case fans, they don't need to have dynamic speed adjustment based on thermals, all they need to do is provide enough airflow to keep the air coming into the case and being drawn out of the rear. So setting a static speed on them is the best course of action. Once they're all on that header, we can just set on static speed on the motherboard header that the fan controller sits in.

So you don't need to worry about any of the USB headers or the radiator fans (as those are a closed separate unit), just the case fan headers fitting onto the fan controller.

The reason it's loud is that those case fans without the controller aren't speed adjustable, and so will run at full speed on a standard motherboard header. Whereas on that controller, they gain control over their speeds, once they're all on there, we can then optimise a good static speed that can transfer air effectively, but with minimal noise. Those fans are very efficient, so it will be entirely feasible to have great airflow with very low background noise.

The cooler fans on the radiator you will also be able to further optimise, the standard profiles set are always more aggressive than they need to be, and that cooler model (with the larger 140mm fans) can operate at low RPM and still be extremely effective because of the increased fan size. So we can definitely optimise those further, but for now, lets concentrate on the case fans as I fully believe those are the ones causing proper noise.

 

[Scott]

Plug 3 looks like it's loose also. Try pushing it in in case there is power but no speed signal.

 

[jergil]

Hiya

Apologies, had to crash out.

For now we're only concerned about the case fans.

The PWM controller for the case is what's pictured in the top left picture with the green 3 being a case fan header, and the blue 1 being the controller main connector that plugs into the motherboard. Really all the case fan headers should be plugged into that, so we should see the 4pin on the rights to the motherboard, and then all three 3 pin case fan headers connected on the board to the left of that

With case fans, they don't need to have dynamic speed adjustment based on thermals, all they need to do is provide enough airflow to keep the air coming into the case and being drawn out of the rear. So setting a static speed on them is the best course of action. Once they're all on that header, we can just set on static speed on the motherboard header that the fan controller sits in.

So you don't need to worry about any of the USB headers or the radiator fans (as those are a closed separate unit), just the case fan headers fitting onto the fan controller.

The reason it's loud is that those case fans without the controller aren't speed adjustable, and so will run at full speed on a standard motherboard header. Whereas on that controller, they gain control over their speeds, once they're all on there, we can then optimise a good static speed that can transfer air effectively, but with minimal noise. Those fans are very efficient, so it will be entirely feasible to have great airflow with very low background noise.

The cooler fans on the radiator you will also be able to further optimise, the standard profiles set are always more aggressive than they need to be, and that cooler model (with the larger 140mm fans) can operate at low RPM and still be extremely effective because of the increased fan size. So we can definitely optimise those further, but for now, lets concentrate on the case fans as I fully believe those are the ones causing proper noise.

No worries at all, thanks for the assist Spyder.

Agreed on the case fans being the issue. I adjusted the cooling settings in iCUE from balanced to quiet and there was no perceivable difference in volume to me as they are being drowned out by the case fans.

So just to double check I'm on the same page, my understanding is that at the moment the rear case fan is plugged into one of the 4 pin case fan headers, which is correct. The PWM controller labelled in blue (left) is plugged directly into the mobo at CHA_FAN5 (AKA SYS_FAN5), which is also correct.

From there it's still a bit unclear to me, but I've found a handy diagram of what I think is the case fan hub:

So going by this diagram and your comments, all fans (except the radiator fans) should be plugged into either the 3 or 4 pin headers on the controller/nexus fan hub.

I'm not home so can't check right now but if I'm understanding you correctly, is my next course of action is to ensure the above statement is correct?

Or is it possible that they are all plugged in correctly already (i.e. the remaining fans are all 3 pin and already plugged in to the case headers) and all I need to do is reduce the fan speed of CHA_FAN5 in the bios?

 

[jergil]

Plug 3 looks like it's loose also. Try pushing it in in case there is power but no speed signal.

Thanks Scott, will do.

 

[Scott]

There are some strange things I'm seeing.

I don't understand why the rear fan has a 3 pin plug yet you have marked the yellow 2 as being the front fans with 4 pin plugs? I'm almost positive that those are from the AIO fans, with the lower 2 connections being the RGB connections.

It's quite difficult as the images are very low quality so even zooming in doesn't allow much visibility. I believe you have yet to trace the front 2 fans on the case.

The fans should work and be controllable through either controller. The stock controller in image 1 uses the motherboard configuration/speed to determine the control of those fans. This can be dynamic or static (static is the simplest solution and is fine for 99% of cases).

The aftermarket controller that comes with the AIO can also be used to control a bunch of case fans as well. These are configurable via iCue.

If you want to control the fans static through the BIOS, connect them all to the case hub (image 1).
If you want to control the fans static through iCue, connect them all to the secondary hub (commander core I believe) in image 3.

If I were in your shoes, I would switch everything off and get it into a good area where you can see exactly what's going where with confidence. I don't think we are quite there yet. Definitely fix that connection marked 3 first though. It's not close to home.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I'm not home so can't check right now but if I'm understanding you correctly, is my next course of action is to ensure the above statement is correct?

That's correct, they should all be on the Nexus fan hub, from there we can then set a decent static speed that's the best performance vs noise for you.

Or is it possible that they are all plugged in correctly already (i.e. the remaining fans are all 3 pin and already plugged in to the case headers) and all I need to do is reduce the fan speed of CHA_FAN5 in the bios?

If you can post a better picture showing the whole controller we may be able to determine more.

From my understanding all the case fans should be 3pin as they're not PWM

 

[Scott]

That's correct, they should all be on the Nexus fan hub, from there we can then set a decent static speed that's the best performance vs noise for you.


If you can post a better picture showing the whole controller we may be able to determine more.

From my understanding all the case fans should be 3pin as they're not PWM

They were all 3 pin when I had them. I was worried the OP was confusing the fan cables marked "2" for the case fans. I don't think we know where the front case fans are yet.

I'm suspecting directly onto the MB somewhere and uncontrolled/nonconfigured

 

[jergil]

There are some strange things I'm seeing.

I don't understand why the rear fan has a 3 pin plug yet you have marked the yellow 2 as being the front fans with 4 pin plugs? I'm almost positive that those are from the AIO fans, with the lower 2 connections being the RGB connections.

It's quite difficult as the images are very low quality so even zooming in doesn't allow much visibility. I believe you have yet to trace the front 2 fans on the case.

The fans should work and be controllable through either controller. The stock controller in image 1 uses the motherboard configuration/speed to determine the control of those fans. This can be dynamic or static (static is the simplest solution and is fine for 99% of cases).

The aftermarket controller that comes with the AIO can also be used to control a bunch of case fans as well. These are configurable via iCue.

If you want to control the fans static through the BIOS, connect them all to the case hub (image 1).
If you want to control the fans static through iCue, connect them all to the secondary hub (commander core I believe) in image 3.

If I were in your shoes, I would switch everything off and get it into a good area where you can see exactly what's going where with confidence. I don't think we are quite there yet. Definitely fix that connection marked 3 first though. It's not close to home.

Sorry @Scott, the confusion was probably caused by me initially thinking @SpyderTracks was referring to the AIO hub when he first mentioned a fan hub/controller, but I have since located the case hub he was referring to. My naming and colouring conventions could have used a bit more thought too.

By 'top fans' (these being plugged into the AIO hub and marked in yellow) I meant the radiator fans (not the front fans). I wasn't able to trace the front fans as of yet (which you surmised correctly)

Re image quality, the forum kept saying they were too big even after compressing them twice so I gave up and took a screenshot. Next time I'll stick them on google drive. I'll take the PC to a better lit room too.

In the meantime I zoomed in on the original image of 3 pin plug leading from the rear fan which looked loose. It does actually appear to be plugged in all the way but into a 4 pin header (is this normal??)

 

[Scott]

Sorry @Scott, the confusion was probably caused by me initially thinking @SpyderTracks was referring to the AIO hub when he first mentioned a fan hub/controller, but I have since located the case hub he was referring to. My naming and colouring conventions could have used a bit more thought too.

By 'top fans' (these being plugged into the AIO hub and marked in yellow) I meant the radiator fans (not the front fans). I wasn't able to trace the front fans as of yet (which you surmised correctly)

Re image quality, the forum kept saying they were too big even after compressing them twice so I gave up and took a screenshot. Next time I'll stick them on google drive. I'll take the PC to a better lit room too.

In the meantime I zoomed in on the original image of 3 pin plug leading from the rear fan which looked loose. It does actually appear to be plugged in all the way but into a 4 pin header (is this normal??)

View attachment 42331

I don't think that would work the way it's configured. Full speed or no speed would be the likely outcome as it will either be getting 5v or 0 v depending how bad that connection is.

It's possible the PWN connections are voltage controlled as a hybrid but I don't know if it would sense the lack of PWN connection from the 4th pin in order to enact that. 4 pin fans have a feed and return speed signal, the speed of the fan is controlled at the fan side from the 4th line. With 3 pin fans they only report the speed back to the controller, the fan doesn't have on-board control so needs controlled by the voltage feeding it.

To keep it really simple. Connect all the 3 pin fan plugs onto the 3 pin fan headers at the left of the board.

 

[Scott]

Ok I just did some intense googling.

Apparently there must be a fan connected to fan header 1. This cannot be changed as it's the return feed for the motherboard to detect a connected fan. What I cannot find is whether that needs to be a PWM fan, I can't think why it would as it's the tacho return that it's likely required but I don't know for certain. The image you have posted on the Nexus+ states that it must be PWM. You don't have a spare PWM fan to use so I would guess that's why you would see full chat.

If it works as PCS have intended, you do indeed need one fan on the Fan 1 connection as you currently have (it's just not plugged in correctly). The other 2 fans should then be on 2 of the other 3 pin connections.

If it doesn't work as they have intended and actually requires a 4 pin PWM signal on connection 1 then you need to move all the chassis fans over to the commander core hub and control them through icue.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had the PC in front of me as I would really like to know which combinations do what.

 

[Scott]

Sorry, for yet another spiel. I'm trying to help with understanding on what does what here so wanted to keep it separate.

3 pin fans are controlled via voltage. When connecting a 3 pin fan to a 4 pin connection, you need to tell the controller of that connection that you wish to control the fan via voltage rather than PWM. For a dynamic control you then tell the controller what temperature you wish to use as a reference for the fan speed. The controller then ramps the voltage up and down based on the monitored temperature.

PWM fans aren't all that different. The only change is that the voltage regulation happens on the fan itself with a pre-programmed understanding of what voltage = which fan speed. It's far more controlled and bespoke to the fan design and intent, hence why often considered the better option. They can also go considerably lower as the lower speed cut off is a known, rather than a guess.

If you are controlling a 3 pin fan on a 4 pin header, you must tell the controlling device that you are using a voltage control rather than PWM. This is where the configuration comes into play. If you have a 3 pin on a 4 pin and don't tell the controller, the controller will give the full 5v at all times and expect the fan to adjust based on the PWM signal (which it isn't receiving). If the controller knows that a voltage controlled fan is connected then the controller will then adjust the voltage sent determined by either a static value or the associated temperature status.

I'm not sure what happens if you tell a PWM fan to use voltage. My guess is it will just hit a static value based on zero signal but I don't actually know for sure.

 

[jergil]

Ok I just did some intense googling.

Apparently there must be a fan connected to fan header 1. This cannot be changed as it's the return feed for the motherboard to detect a connected fan. What I cannot find is whether that needs to be a PWM fan, I can't think why it would as it's the tacho return that it's likely required but I don't know for certain. The image you have posted on the Nexus+ states that it must be PWM. You don't have a spare PWM fan to use so I would guess that's why you would see full chat.

If it works as PCS have intended, you do indeed need one fan on the Fan 1 connection as you currently have (it's just not plugged in correctly). The other 2 fans should then be on 2 of the other 3 pin connections.

If it doesn't work as they have intended and actually requires a 4 pin PWM signal on connection 1 then you need to move all the chassis fans over to the commander core hub and control them through icue.

This is one of those situations where I wish I had the PC in front of me as I would really like to know which combinations do what.

No apologies needed, I am very thankful for the spiels!

So if the PCS tech knew enough to connect the 3 pin fan to the 4 pin header on the case hub for the return feed to the mobo (nice one for finding this out), chances are the two other 3 pin fans are also connected to the hub. But there's the possibility that the controller doesn't know that it should be controlling the case fans via voltage rather than PWM, so the case fans are all operating at full speed. OR they ARE being controlled by voltage, but they are getting too much juice (for my liking anyway) and need to be tuned down (presumably through the BIOS?).

Another possibility is that the current assumed config might not work as PCS intended when there's no PWM fan plugged into CHA_FAN1 on the case hub, and instead I need to plug them all into the commander hub (or potentially directly into the mobo and controlled by voltage individually?)

Finally, seeing as I haven't located SYS_FAN #1 or 2 yet (or traced the front fans), there's still a chance that the two front fans are plugged directly into the mobo, and instead need to go into the case hub (or alternatively into the commander). This seems the least likely to me.

Am I roughly on track?

 

[Scott]

There are a few scenarios that are possible but that's the general jist of it. You will need to look to the left of where you took the first picture to see if there are 2 fans connected to it. If they are, that's your case fans.

If everything is connected to the controller and fan 3 is pushed in correctly.... that could solve all the problems.

 

[jergil]

There are a few scenarios that are possible but that's the general jist of it. You will need to look to the left of where you took the first picture to see if there are 2 fans connected to it. If they are, that's your case fans.

If everything is connected to the controller and fan 3 is pushed in correctly.... that could solve all the problems.

Ok thanks! By fan 3 being pushed in correctly, do you mean repositioned so that the pin on the right is making contact instead of the pin on the left?