My cooling system may be broken

[Hibernian]

Ok, so I bought a PC Specialist desktop back in December 2012. First of all, here's my specs:

Case: COOLERMASTER HAF 922 MID TOWER GAMING CASE
Overclocked CPU: Overclocked Intel® Core™i7-3770k Quad Core (3.50GHz @ max 4.60GHz)
Motherboard: ASUS® P8Z77-V PRO/THUNDERBOLT
Memory (RAM): 16GB KINGSTON HYPERX GENESIS DUAL-DDR3 2133MHz X.M.P (4 x 4GB KIT)
Graphics Card: 2GB NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 680 - 2 DVI, HDMI, DP
Memory - 1st Hard Disk: 480GB INTEL® 520 SERIES SSD, SATA 6 Gb/s (upto 550MB/sR | 520MB/sW)
2nd Hard Disk: 2TB WD CAVIAR BLACK WD2002FAEX, SATA 6 Gb/s, 64MB CACHE (7200rpm)
1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive: 12x BLU-RAY RE-WRITER DRIVE, 16x DVD ±R/±RW
Memory Card Reader: INTERNAL 52 IN 1 CARD READER (XD, MS, CF, SD, etc) + 1 x USB 2.0 PORT
Power Supply: CORSAIR 850W PRO SERIES™ HX850-80 PLUS® GOLD MODULAR
Processor Cooling: Corsair H100 Hydro Series High Performance CPU Cooler
Thermal Paste: ARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUND
Sound Card: ASUS Xonar DS
Network Facilities: 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT - AS STANDARD ON ALL PCs
USB Options: 6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD

Operating System: Windows 7 (64-bit)
Warranty: 3 Year Gold Warranty (2 Year Collect & Return, 2 Year Parts, 3 Year
Labour)


Now, just today I've encountered a major problem. The computer was acting very sluggishly this morning and so I restarted it, because I assumed it was just some software issue. Then when it was rebooting I got an error on the American Megatrends screen saying "CPU fan error" and "CPU temperature warning".

The setup BIOS confirmed this, saying that the CPU fan was not on and the CPU temp was 105 degrees C! When the computer was back on, I used the Core Temp program and it also said the temperature was around 105 degrees.

So, I turned the system off (unplugged) and spent about an hour cleaning the fans and heat sinks (which I needed to do anyway because they had a lot of dust on them). The PC is working right now, but the CPU temperature is around 80 degrees while idol. It was around 30 degrees when I was in the BIOS, but the temp quickly ran up to 60, 70, 80... etc. It's 90 degrees now just while I'm typing this and have no other programs active. It doesn't seem sluggish right now, but I dare not try to do anything else.

What could be the problem here? My cooling system is the Corsair H100 Hydro, i.e. this thing:

It's a liquid cooler that pumps some liquid around the CPU and then up to a metal heat sink on top, and then expels the heat by two fans. The two fans on top are still working fine, so far as I can see (they are whizzing very hard to try to cool things). There are also two other case fans, which are working as well (front and back).

The BIOS said there was a problem with the "CPU fan", but I'm not sure this setup has a fan on the CPU, only the two fans on top. Could it be the pump system that's broken? I know there's a central unit attached to the CPU and the pump system, is that what the BIOS thinks is the "CPU fan"?

If so, there's nothing obviously wrong with it that I can see, the light is still on it and you can even press the button on the front which controls the intensity of the fans.

Or could this perhaps be something to do with the Thermal Paste? Can thermal paste break or detach from the CPU somehow? Or is it more likely to do a mechanical/software issue with the cooler?


Any help you guys could offer would be greatly appreciated, as I can't really do anything with the computer at the moment, besides a bit of Internet surfing. And I'm really worried this could cause permanent damage to the CPU.

 

[SpyderTracks]

The motherboard will have a fan header labelled CPU Fan. Whichever fans plugged into that is the one failing. You’ll need to check your motherboard manual to find out which one.

When you cleaned the fans and heat sinks, did you detach the cpu heat sink? Sounds like it desperately needs repasting.

 

[Hibernian]

The motherboard will have a fan header labelled CPU Fan. Whichever fans plugged into that is the one failing. You’ll need to check your motherboard manual to find out which one.

Well, like I said, there is no fan attached to the CPU, there is a pump unit which is part of the H100 liquid cooler. The BIOS is just calling it a fan, but I think the BIOS just doesn't understand what it is.

When you cleaned the fans and heat sinks, did you detach the cpu heat sink? Sounds like it desperately needs repasting.

No I didn't detach the CPU heat sink (if that's what it's called). I'm not sure I'd know how to do that (the whole system was assembled by PC Specialist, so I'm not very knowledgeable about it). Is it safe to disassemble the cooler over the CPU?

If it is to do with the thermal paste why would it have had a sudden failure?

Is there any way to know whether the pump is broken or the paste is failing? How would I determine that?

 

[SpyderTracks]

Well, like I said, there is no fan attached to the CPU, there is a pump unit which is part of the H100 liquid cooler. The BIOS is just calling it a fan, but I think the BIOS just doesn't understand what it is.


No I didn't detach the CPU heat sink (if that's what it's called). I'm not sure I'd know how to do that (the whole system was assembled by PC Specialist, so I'm not very knowledgeable about it). Is it safe to disassemble the cooler over the CPU?

If it is to do with the thermal paste why would it have had a sudden failure?

Is there any way to know whether the pump is broken or the paste is failing? How would I determine that?

The fan plugged into the CPU_FAN header on the motherboard is the fan that it's complaining about. It could be any fan in your system plugged in there, you have to find out which one is to determine where the failure is. The fans on the Radiator of the H100 are likely to be labelled as CPU_FAN, but it could be any fan in your system.

Install Corsair Link, that will tell you what component of the H100 has failed.

 

[Hibernian]

The fan plugged into the CPU_FAN header on the motherboard is the fan that it's complaining about. It could be any fan in your system plugged in there, you have to find out which one is to determine where the failure is. The fans on the Radiator of the H100 are likely to be labelled as CPU_FAN, but it could be any fan in your system.

Well, like I said, all the fans are operating as normal. I've got two case fans (front and back), a fan on the GPU and two top fans which are part of the H100 cooling system. There is no fan directly attached to the CPU. What's over the CPU is the H100 pump unit. I have no idea what the BIOS is referring to as the CPU fan, because all my fans are functioning.

Install Corsair Link, that will tell you what component of the H100 has failed.

Ok, I've installed it, but it doesn't tell me much. All this thing does is give temperature read outs and fans speeds.

Here's the main readout from Corsair Link:

You can see the CPU temperatures there, at around 95 degrees under only 2% load.

I'm not sure what all 8 of those other temperatures are, they appear to be things connected to the motherboard (which is the top part). It might be the RAM units or other components. Most of them are ok, except perhaps those that are close to the over-heated CPU.

Only two fans are listed here, which I think may be the two case fans. Which would make sense since they are different sizes, so might be spinning at different RPMs. I don't think the H100's cooling fans are listed in this. In fact this readout doesn't tell me anything about the Corsair cooling system. There's certainly no information about the pump and whether it's operating or not.


How should I proceed from here?

Should I try to contact PC Specialist? (I know my computer is out of warranty/insurance, but I'm wondering if they would give me some advice at least). Or should I maybe ask for help from Corsair? (I've seen they have a forum).

 

[SpyderTracks]

Well, like I said, all the fans are operating as normal. I've got two case fans (front and back), a fan on the GPU and two top fans which are part of the H100 cooling system. There is no fan directly attached to the CPU. What's over the CPU is the H100 pump unit. I have no idea what the BIOS is referring to as the CPU fan, because all my fans are functioning.


Ok, I've installed it, but it doesn't tell me much. All this thing does is give temperature read outs and fans speeds.

Here's the main readout from Corsair Link:

You can see the CPU temperatures there, at around 95 degrees under only 2% load.

I'm not sure what all 8 of those other temperatures are, they appear to be things connected to the motherboard (which is the top part). It might be the RAM units or other components. Most of them are ok, except perhaps those that are close to the over-heated CPU.

Only two fans are listed here, which I think may be the two case fans. Which would make sense since they are different sizes, so might be spinning at different RPMs. I don't think the H100's cooling fans are listed in this. In fact this readout doesn't tell me anything about the Corsair cooling system. There's certainly no information about the pump and whether it's operating or not.


How should I proceed from here?

Should I try to contact PC Specialist? (I know my computer is out of warranty/insurance, but I'm wondering if they would give me some advice at least). Or should I maybe ask for help from Corsair? (I've seen they have a forum).

I can only say it once more... you need to check the CPU_FAN header on the motherboard to see what’s plugged in there. There’s no point guessing, it could be anything, but you need to know and the only way to do that is find what’s physically plugged into that fan header. Only then can you know how to proceed.

And I’d leave the pc off until you’re able to diagnose.

 

[Hibernian]

I can only say it once more... you need to check the CPU_FAN header on the motherboard to see what’s plugged in there. There’s no point guessing, it could be anything, but you need to know and the only way to do that is find what’s physically plugged into that fan header. Only then can you know how to proceed.

Ok, but I have no idea where that is, or how to check it. I've just turned the system off and taken a look at the motherboard, but I can't work out where this fan header would be. I Googled the manual for the P8Z77-V motherboard, but I couldn't find anything in there about fan headers.

I did find this other random forum post while searching, and it seems like it might be the same issue: https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/728455-cpu-fan-error-asus-p8z77-v-deluxe-h100-help/

And I’d leave the pc off until you’re able to diagnose.

Well, I need the computer on to post here. I've actually setup a Dyson room cooler fan to blow cold air into the inside of the PC, which is keeping the temperatures from going over 100 degrees at least.

 

[SpyderTracks]

Ok, but I have no idea where that is, or how to check it. I've just turned the system off and taken a look at the motherboard, but I can't work out where this fan header would be. I Googled the manual for the P8Z77-V motherboard, but I couldn't find anything in there about fan headers.

I did find this other random forum post while searching, and it seems like it might be the same issue: https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/728455-cpu-fan-error-asus-p8z77-v-deluxe-h100-help/


Well, I need the computer on to post here. I've actually setup a Dyson room cooler fan to blow cold air into the inside of the PC, which is keeping the temperatures from going over 100 degrees at least.

Yeah, it does look like the same issue.

I’d try what they suggest a few replies down:

“Swap the fan header on CPU_FAN to another header. Yup. Then you will definitely get the "CPU fan error" because you won't have a CPU Fan, so make sure that other setting is set to "ignore" in the BIOS. If it fixes the temperature, great, if not, afraid you'll need a new CPU cooler.”

It does sound like the pump may have failed unfortunately.

I’m sure PCS will accommodate you to fit a replacement out of warranty, may be worth giving them a call to discuss your options. Personally if you do replace it with another closed liquid cooler, I’d recommend the H1100V2 as it’s a lot more “intelligent” and shows pump speeds and gives warnings all over the place, plus a lot more reliable.

Do you not have a phone you can use for the forum? Likelihood is at those temps you’ll cause lasting damage \ failure of cpu and or motherboard.

 

[Hibernian]

Yeah, it does look like the same issue.

I’d try what they suggest a few replies down:

“Swap the fan header on CPU_FAN to another header. Yup. Then you will definitely get the "CPU fan error" because you won't have a CPU Fan, so make sure that other setting is set to "ignore" in the BIOS. If it fixes the temperature, great, if not, afraid you'll need a new CPU cooler.”

It does sound like the pump may have failed unfortunately.

How would I do this fan head swap? Do you mean connecting some cable inside to another plug? Or do you mean chaning some setting in the BIOS?

I’m sure PCS will accommodate you to fit a replacement out of warranty, may be worth giving them a call to discuss your options. Personally if you do replace it with another closed liquid cooler, I’d recommend the H1100V2 as it’s a lot more “intelligent” and shows pump speeds and gives warnings all over the place, plus a lot more reliable.

Do you not have a phone you can use for the forum? Likelihood is at those temps you’ll cause lasting damage \ failure of cpu and or motherboard.

Ok, do you mean the H110i v2 or the H100i V2? I've no problem putting in a similar unit, as at least I know it will fit and where to put it.

How difficult would it be to install a new one on my own? I can plug in wires and screw things, if I'm told exactly where to do it. But if it's more complicated than that...

 

[Lez501]

Ok, but I have no idea where that is, or how to check it.

The CPU Header fan is Point 1, second from right (other fan headers are also shown. You need to locate what is connected to the CPU_FAN header

HTH

 

[SpyderTracks]

How would I do this fan head swap? Do you mean connecting some cable inside to another plug? Or do you mean chaning some setting in the BIOS?


Ok, do you mean the H110i v2 or the H100i V2? I've no problem putting in a similar unit, as at least I know it will fit and where to put it.

How difficult would it be to install a new one on my own? I can plug in wires and screw things, if I'm told exactly where to do it. But if it's more complicated than that...

H100V2 will be ample, it’s the replacement for the one you have. Pretty sure it’s the same cost as the H100

If you’re uncomfortable with fan headers, I’d suggest letting PCS do it. You have to attach the radiator, plug in a USB header, repaste the cpu and then fit the heat sink.

Thanks @Lez501 for the diagram, would have done so myself but still at work.

 

[Hibernian]

The CPU Header fan is Point 1, second from right (other fan headers are also shown. You need to locate what is connected to the CPU_FAN header

HTH

View attachment 11605

Ok, thanks for that. My motherboard is slightly different to that model, but the two CPU fans slots are in the same place, so I've found them. I've tried putting the cable that was in the CPU fan slot into the next slot along, which is called CPU OPT on my motherboard. It didn't make any difference, still got the same error in the BIOS and it is now over-heating again.

So does this mean that the pump unit is likely broken?

H100V2 will be ample, it’s the replacement for the one you have. Pretty sure it’s the same cost as the H100

If you’re uncomfortable with fan headers, I’d suggest letting PCS do it. You have to attach the radiator, plug in a USB header, repaste the cpu and then fit the heat sink.

Thanks @Lez501 for the diagram, would have done so myself but still at work.

Ok, well I'm in Ireland, so sending the computer over to PC Specialist in Britain might be a bit awkward and time consuming. Maybe I could get it done by some local computer repair company. Or maybe I could get my friend who knows a thing or two about computers to help me out (plus watch some YouTube videos of how it's done).

Do you think I just need to buy a new cooling system now then?

 

[Oussebon]

How difficult would it be to install a new one on my own? I can plug in wires and screw things, if I'm told exactly where to do it. But if it's more complicated than that...

Installing anything in a PC is basically just this.

For the CPU cooler you will need to repaste, but this is ultimately very straightforward.

I'd suggest you watch some videos online to get a sense of what's involved. If you think you'll be happy doing it, possibly with your mate as a 2nd pair of hands, great - it's a learning experience and cheaper than getting a PC shop to do it for you. And the online guides are all free so you lose nothing.

Note that as well as AIO water coolers like the H100i V2 (which would the the straight replacement for your current one) there are air coolers as well. The HAF 922 apparently supports air coolers upto 175mm in height, so should easily take a Noctua.
e.g.

H100 GTX (aka V2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFstDuftJow
Noctua NH U14S https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAZvub8TQtQ
Cleaning the paste off a CPU and applying fresh paste: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hNgFNH7zhQ

Arctic Silver who do thermal paste also do an 'ArctiClean' kit which works fine and is useful if you don't know what to buy to clean a CPU: http://www.arcticsilver.com/arcticlean.htm

Do you think I just need to buy a new cooling system now then?

I'll defer to the others (though to me it sounds like that's likely).

If you want an H100i V2 there'd be no harm contacting Corsair. Your product will be out of warranty (5 years, so Dec 2017) but Corsair's customer support is said to be good and they might do you a discount on an H100i V2.
Although if it's via the Corsair store, be sure to check around first as stuff on there can be a lot more expensive than on general retailers.

Otherwise things like a tower Noctua cooler will be more than sufficient. I have my 3770k OCed by PCS on a P8Z77-V motherboard cooled by a Titan Gemini, which is not as high end as a Noctua.

 

[SpyderTracks]

I think the h100v2 comes pre pasted, so that lessens the complication a bit.

All good advise from Oussebon as usual!

 

[Hibernian]

Ok, thanks a lot guys. Is there any way I can test definitively if the pump is working or not?


Anyway, I talked to my friend on the phone and he said he knows how to install these things and will help me out, so I may go ahead an order a new cooler. And I can consult the videos you've shown.

Any opinions on which is the best? I could just go with the Corsair H100i V2, which is the upgraded model of the one I have now. There's also one called the H110i, which looks very similar and is slightly more expensive. There's one or two online shops that have them in Ireland (I'd prefer to get it as quickly as possible, so would want to avoid long shipping times from overseas). I probably wouldn't want to spend more than ~€150 on it though.

Should I order thermal paste as well, or rely on the stuff that comes with the cooler (if it does)? I've heard that you should use the more high quality, expensive pastes, but I'm not knowledgeable about it at all.


And lastly, what's your opinions on operating the computer without a functioning cooling system for a few days? I know some of you have said it could be dangerous and could cause damage, but my friend said he didn't think 100 degree temperatures were anything to worry about, and some YouTube videos I looked at seemed to say the same thing. I know the CPU will throttle itself back and possibly even shut down if it goes above 105 degrees, as a safety measure, so can't I just rely on that?

I currently am trying to keep the room cold and have a Dyson fan blowing cold air onto the inside of the computer, which reduces the temps by at least 5 or 10 degrees from what they would otherwise be. But how risky is it to use the system like this?

 

[SpyderTracks]

Ok, thanks a lot guys. Is there any way I can test definitively if the pump is working or not?


Anyway, I talked to my friend on the phone and he said he knows how to install these things and will help me out, so I may go ahead an order a new cooler. And I can consult the videos you've shown.

Any opinions on which is the best? I could just go with the Corsair H100i V2, which is the upgraded model of the one I have now. There's also one called the H110i, which looks very similar and is slightly more expensive. There's one or two online shops that have them in Ireland (I'd prefer to get it as quickly as possible, so would want to avoid long shipping times from overseas). I probably wouldn't want to spend more than ~€150 on it though.

Should I order thermal paste as well, or rely on the stuff that comes with the cooler (if it does)? I've heard that you should use the more high quality, expensive pastes, but I'm not knowledgeable about it at all.


And lastly, what's your opinions on operating the computer without a functioning cooling system for a few days? I know some of you have said it could be dangerous and could cause damage, but my friend said he didn't think 100 degree temperatures were anything to worry about, and some YouTube videos I looked at seemed to say the same thing. I know the CPU will throttle itself back and possibly even shut down if it goes above 105 degrees, as a safety measure, so can't I just rely on that?

I currently am trying to keep the room cold and have a Dyson fan blowing cold air onto the inside of the computer, which reduces the temps by at least 5 or 10 degrees from what they would otherwise be. But how risky is it to use the system like this?

A system without a cpu cooler WILL fry the cpu and likely damage the motherboard also, it shouldn’t be powered on at all without one. It’s not possible to cool a cpu in any way externally, the temps run from inside the cpu, they’re not affected much by ambient temps of the range your ire talking.

The H110 is a different model with a larger radiator which probably wouldn’t fit in the case. It’s also a lot older.

The paste that’s pre applied will be fine.

 

[Oussebon]

It also doesn't really matter which is better. A Noctua tower cooler like the U14S, an H100i, H110i etc would all prove more than adequate cooling.

but my friend said he didn't think 100 degree temperatures were anything to worry about,

Well, they're technically below the 105 degrees at which the CPU is shut off in order to prevent damage... but they're really not very far below that. As above, running a PC without a working cooler is unnecessarily risky.

It's a bit like not worrying about crashing your car because you have airbags. The safety measures are there as a last resort, not a first line of defence.

Note that while blowing (cool) air into a PC could help with temps, you still don't have a functioning cooler. Also blowing air into the system can sometimes hinder rather than help. It's no substitute for a working cooler.

 

[jerpers]

To manually check the pump, you should feel a slight vibration if you put your hand against the block on the CPU or hold the pipes.

There should be a cable coming from the CPU block (pump) that should be going into the CPU fan header as discussed before. If that is posting around 2000rpm in the BIOS the pump is fine. If it is producing an error, it is likely the pump is broken.

As Oussebon suggested, try contacting Corsair support. They were great when I had an old PSU break out of warranty.

If ordering a new H100 v2, I wouldn't bother with the paste but definitely get some articlean to remove the old paste from the PSU.

 

[Hibernian]

Ok guys, I went ahead and ordered a new H100i v2, from custompcparts.ie. 2 to 5 days for delivery, here's hoping it'll be on the shorter end of that timeframe.

I'm pretty certain now that the old cooler is totally broken, as one of the top fans stopped working this morning. I tried checking the tubes from the pump like @jerpers suggested and I cannot feel anything moving. So yeah, it's almost certainly dead.

I'm only going to use the computer sparingly over the next few days. My current CPU temps are at around 70 degrees and holding steady around there.


So thanks for all the help. I'll come back if I have any further issues (such as installation difficulties), but if you don't hear from me again, that means it's all working fine.

 

[Hibernian]

Just an update on this. They finally delivered the new cooler yesterday and me and my friend installed it (with some difficulty). Took us about 3 hours, but we got it done and the system is fixed now.

My temperatures are around 25 to 30 degrees when idle and I couldn't get it to go above 55 or 60 even when running stress tests and games. So it works. It's also much quieter than the old model, which is great.

The cooler came with it's own thermal paste already applied (we carefully removed the old stuff), so I hope that's ok to use.