Diary of ordering via PCSpecialists - The good, bad, and possibly the ugly.

dv8tion242

Active member
This will be my (yes, 'my' because I'm so awesome) kinda sorta diary of getting an order via PCS. I've have worked building PC's before and in phone support, so I know what time-stressed environment they are. There's constant stress about getting orders out and right.
I'll try to base this 'diary' on what is based because of what is shown on the screen (not what needs to be dug-out on other screens) and what experience leads me to. I'll try to be fair and objective as possible.

Stage 1:
-- The usual process of agonizing about parts and prices is pretty easy. Tiresome in any customizing arena, but generally pretty easy..
Getting an order filled if your credit card has an address outside the shipping area not so much.
-- If the card has, say a US address, you're pretty much done-for right there. Fortunately, I there's a debit card with a UK address and the order was OK'd.
-- "Credit Card (will carry a 2% surcharge)" might have also been useful as well, before putting any numbers in.
-- Would probably been helpful also if the postal-code lists the 'standard' and free area sooner so having to edit the order. All in all, it's like buying a car. Everything is fast and slick, right up until you start hitting the purchase button.
-- The logical order of things seems a bit off. For example putting in one's postal-code during the customization page before finding out the order can't be processed due to shipping areas could be handy.
-- The 'extra' cooling paste, and while I do agree good cooling compound is well worthwhile, is a complete rip-off at 9 quid. Unless the tube of it is in-closed. I bought a tube of Arctic Silver 3, (3.0 grams), must be the better part of 10 years ago for $12 something, and I'm only about half-way through it. The amount needed on a CPU is about the size of a pin-head, spread evenly (basically all you're doing is filling the minute gaps) and the stuff lasts for ages. The amount of the new Arctic model spread on is probably not even one penny's worth. This is Doubly true when a full 4.0g tube of ARCTIC MX-4 can be bought for £3.99.
That said, as most people probably don't have CPU cooling compounds just sitting around, decent compound is totally worth putting on for long-term CPU happiness and sucking up the 9 quid. Enjoying the huge savings elsewhere.
-- Got an auto-email which confirms the OK.
-- I do have to give credit to PCS, in that they didn't close the phone line waiting cue at closing time. Wasn't planning on calling so didn't know I'd have less then 8 minutes before 1pm closing today (Saturday) - Called at about 6 minutes to, and waited with bated breath as the clock clicked past 1:pm. Whoever it was answered after 1:02pm-ish, thanks!
For all the above, PCS is onto a shaky but reasonably decent start. I'm willing to forgive & forget a lot.

Stage 2: Every week or so, there's been an automated update message..

After building (still not sure why it says this in the present tense.. )
In Building

If your order status says In Building, this means that your order has now been built. You may find that your order now has notes attached to it. You can view these by clicking "show" on your order.

the laptop is now..
In Testing

If your order status says In Testing, this means that your order has now entered the testing, configuration and quality control process. You may find that your order now has notes attached to it. You can view these by clicking "show" on your order.


Stage 3: Burning in and Distribution (To be filled in.)



[and yes, this is not the happy-go-lucky review that is liked or expected. I'm just picky like that.. ]
 
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dv8tion242

Active member
I'm on the fence about cancelling my laptop order, not because I think the hardware is overtly lacking, nor does there seem to be any 'hidden' fees. What is lacking is the clarity of what to expect unless a well defined box of Windows (Windows Guarantee (dis)Advantage is installed. Even then, driver issues seem to crop up more than I would expect. Fan noise issues? A company which (ahem) has been around a number of years (2003)? Automated system hardware testing tools exist which take out the need, beyond point&click for skills. They are utterly boring to run through, but anyone can use them.

I'm just not sure how willing I'm to take a 1000 pound gamble, then be told "it's not standard, so tough.".
My reasoning for this is as follows.

Expecting claims of quality with "customer service second to none, and most of all, a new computer/laptop that you will want to show off to your friends and relatives" beyond a shiny case.

What quality service means to me, is no need to buy extra guarantees is something along the lines of this:
"Does xxxxxx offer replacements or exchanges?
Yes, we do. If you received a damaged or defective item, we’ll send you a replacement of the same item."

As it happens, a couple years ago a TV was purchased from xxxxxx. Upon opening, and plugging in the cables, then turning it on, a defect was noted. Whether it happened in transit, no idea. Regardless, the defect was couple of dead pixels. Contacted the company and had no issue getting the TV replaced. Most I had to do was print out a pre-paid postage which was emailed to me, repack the TV, tape on the printed out sheet. Then wait for it to be collected.
A new TV arrived within a week. Easy-Peasy.

Could the same be possible in that same time frame where new custom machines are being built up all day long? Probably not. The variation in systems is, I admit, far too great. What is possible however, is saying something like this across the board, "If there any defects found within 7-14 days they will be resolved at no charge."
If, after that week or two, a person wants coverage, screen issues such as lost pixels should then also be covered under the existing Silver or Gold (or platinum for PC's) warranty. Unless I'm missing something, screens are part of a functioning laptop so should be treated as that complete unit not a separate part.

That all said (and I know how that all sounds), I will be fair and say if there is proof the machine has been running for what is beyond expected use (say 10 hours a day) or obviously just damaged, the screen warranty could called into question.
 

rapiddescent

Bronze Level Poster
yeah - I had noticed that as well, although my wife (who is a paralegal and citizens advice adviser) said that your statuatory rights would apply under the sale of good act so dead pixels etc would fall under the "not of merchantable quality" and it would a be a quick small claims process.

However, having said that, don;t go by what you seen on the forum. people only complain vocally when somehting goes wrong. Search for any manufacturer, Apple, Dell, whomever - and you will see the worst. I chose PCS ahfetr using IBM/Lenovo and Dell laptops for my business because they would give me flexibility to choose.
 

dv8tion242

Active member
Sorry for the delay. Missed the reply entirely.

I'm very happy to be pleasantly surprised, but a comfortable expectation should be receiving a bit of hardware which both parties (the seller and the customer) can both be very proud of and reading happy resolution stories.
I know people tend to vent their spleens when there is a problem, more so than when things are perfect.
The Lenovo laptop which this one is replacing, developed something (forget what it was now) a month or two after arriving and that was also sent back/repaired. Took longer, but still, no problem. And it was a configured model.

Again, I'm not expecting any problem to arise. I am just cheesed off that any customer has to pay, (what was it?) 69 quid for a couple years 'coverage' when a brand new screen would be only 10 more. And the Silver lining is only 5 quid.


According to the ISO standards.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_9241#ISO-9241-302.2C_303.2C_305.2C_307:2008_pixel_defects
Class 0 panels are completely defect-free, including no full pixel or sub-pixel defects.
Class 1 panels permit any or all of the following:
1 full bright (“stuck on white”) pixel
1 full dark (“stuck off”) pixel
2 single or double bright or dark sub-pixels
3 to 5 “stuck on” or “stuck off” sub-pixels (depending on the number of each)
Class 2 panels permit any or all of the following:
2 full bright pixels
2 full dark pixels
5-10 single or double bright or dark sub-pixels (again, depending on the number of each; no more than 5 bright (“stuck on”) subpixels are permitted).
Class 3 panels permit any or all of the following:
5 full bright pixels
15 full dark pixels
50 single or double sub-pixels stuck on or off

So either the products being are high quality, or they're not. Maybe I'm just picky given that I've never seen the excuse of ISO standards being used to justify the need for 'extras'. This dead pixel guarantee sounds like banks offering PPI coverage. As in selling coverage something that is yet unforeseen, but if it does happen, you better have coverage..


Perhaps another example of this sort of selling could be RyanAir.
http://www.ryanair.com/en/terms-and-conditions#regulations-tableoffees
"Oxygen Reservation Fee: - per passenger/per reservation Not Available Online €100 / £100"
Because being able to breath is an extra. :balloon:
 

keynes

Multiverse Poster
I am just cheesed off that any customer has to pay, (what was it?) 69 quid for a couple years 'coverage' when a brand new screen would be only 10 more. And the Silver lining is only 5 quid.
I don't think gold warranty covers dead pixels but any parts you may need to replace as well as postage costs. I think covering my asus laptop for an additional year was around £80 so £69 to me doesn't seem unreasonable. From what I understand you can get a refund if you are not happy within 7 working days from when you received the laptop so if there is a dead pixel you could probably send it back. It is not ideal but if you find 1 or 2 dead pixels I can't think how you can be protected without the dead pixel guarantee since most manufacturers wouldn't replace a screen in that situation.
 

daveeb

Enthusiast
I agree with the "it's non standard" so sort it out yourself comment.....I've been contemplating ordering since back of last year, but i regularly see complaints that drivers aren't installed or aren't installed correctly.. It's a bit worrying that e.g. if I order a Killer wireless card then I have to install the driver(s) myself. WHY ? How can PCS know the card is working if it isn't installed and why can't they install the drivers for it if it's part of the order ?
 

keynes

Multiverse Poster
I ordered my laptop and everything was working fine from the box. I have seen a few comments about issues with drivers but I think they occur due to some people trying to upgrade them.
 

Genome

Bronze Level Poster
I don't think gold warranty covers dead pixels but any parts you may need to replace as well as postage costs. I think covering my asus laptop for an additional year was around £80 so £69 to me doesn't seem unreasonable. From what I understand you can get a refund if you are not happy within 7 working days from when you received the laptop so if there is a dead pixel you could probably send it back. It is not ideal but if you find 1 or 2 dead pixels I can't think how you can be protected without the dead pixel guarantee since most manufacturers wouldn't replace a screen in that situation.

The people who have driver issues tend to be people like me who got it and wanted to install there own copy of windows.

My laptop came with a test version of windows and all the drivers were working. I had some issues when I installed windows because I didn't have the killer drivers on the disk and some drivers only worked in win 8. Sure it was a bit annoying but didn't take long to fix. I even posted links on here for where you can find them.
 

dv8tion242

Active member
24 Jan 2014 16:28 Oban Your order will be with you today between 07:00 and 20:00

OK.. No problem. Other than the delivery date was originally scheduled for the 28th and the email notification arrived at 16:31.. Probably a good thing I was in all day, still sick. Good to know what day(s) I'll need to stay in though.


--

The package was delivered this afternoon by a local delivery outfit; Oban Express. After the original note led me to expect it tomorrow via 2-day, a further DPD update suggested it would be here on Friday. Contacted DPD directly today and they said they had spoken to the Oban office, which meant the box would be here tomorrow. Which is fitting because the web page had by this time changed (yet) again to reflect this.

The keyboard is lower down than the pictures show, but the keyboard itself is pretty good. The touchpad is rough to the touch and the buttons take a bit of pressing to work. On the underside, it feels like some catch hasn't fully clicked and makes a noise when pressed. Fan noise, which was the main concern is not as bad as I was expecting. On the other-hand, the Pioneer DVD drive more than makes up for fan noise. These are little more than minor irritations..
The installed Windows gave me a 7.3 overall score, which isn't too shabby at all.
The screen is very nice, and while the fans are on, runs pretty cool. Although, when off the underside seems to need access to airflow. Don't know what the battery life it like yet..

I'll almost certainly going to keep this laptop, but given that it did not arrive in the expected state (with no operating system - as in no partitions to sort out), the run-around from DPD.
Paying up for perceived quality and convenience next time, sounds like a smart move. Knowing that it can be returned, no shipping costs, no waiting etc. The speakers work but are tinny and faint. Not what I'd call any-good.
The problem is or was 'over-selling'. If an item is sold as quality and custom, it should probably be delivered as quality and as the customer requested. Then again, it was cheap.

Performance of hardware: B+
Quality of system in terms of look and feel: B-
Sound of speakers: C+
Handling of queries (anyone in the food chain PCS/DPD/Local): D

Would I recommend PCS to a new PC user? No.
The forums provide a wealth of information, but like most forums you need to be able to ask the right question. Most common users neither know nor care how their 'toy' works. They need/want something which just works, sort of now. PCS is obviously geared for those people who care about what that glowing box under their desk looks like. Those gamers who spend more on a PC than on a used car. People on the forum are willing to help users get the right machine for the job/budget rather than saying an email user needs 32GB of DDR3.
PCS is not bad as such nor is it some evil business entity out to rob grannies out of their pensions, and that is a plus. They don't go to stupid lengths trying to con the bored business owner or the small business running family. Their box of (official) support is tightly locked shut which sucks. But not really surprising given the collection of Windows logos kicking around the site.

Clevo is the OEM trunk, from which System76, Sager, PCS (and who knows how many more companies) branch off 'custom' PC's. Each has their business model, their own spin on marketing and warranties.. Given that they are effectively the same hardware, it does make me wonder how hard it really is to find someone with experience on this hardware, beyond Windows..

If I have been unfair, please tell me so it can be corrected.
 
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